Universal Health care

sabreclaww

jui jitsoooos
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
Location
New York
so....what do YOU think that actually looks like??? Ever been to a country with it? R you willing to pay everywhere so others can have it???


I have health care for the first time in my late 20s . If i wanted it, i knew i would have to get a job that had it...and CHOSE not to. Thoughts?
 

Noob

www.myspace.com/mmaspot
Joined
Aug 23, 2008
I lived in Spain for a while. I'm no expert, but their system seemed pretty functional to me.

I never had to visit the doctor, but I was told by other foreigners that they never had any problem receiving medical care.

This isn't an endorsement for universal health care, just passing along my experience.
 

FrankieButNotEdgar

Well-Known Member
Site Donor
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
I'm all for people getting free healthcare. It can be known to cause problems but people shouldn't be denied good medical care because they can't afford it.
 

Ninjastix

The Fat Mamba
Site Donor
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
Location
Raleigh
I kinda like the idea of removing high risk people from the same pool as the rest of us, and I'd like to see private adjustable rate insurance that I can purchase irrespective of where I work...

For instance my rate would adjust depending on my health risk, if the risk was created by habit or inheritance, my current place of employment could contribute to help paying a portion of my rate as an incentive for employment...

Being able to have a rate of say 80-160 dollars a month for full coverage with a employee contribution of 25-40% would make me feel more secure than being undercovered...

I don't like the idea of institutionalize coverage, I'd prefer however that outlook for preventative coverage... as in clinics that are federally or state funded to provide general check ups, administer shots, provide free samples of medication for temporary aliments, and help improve diet and activity habits...

That being said, waiting or expecting leaders on the presidential level to accomplish this task is like drawing blood from a stone... I'd rather see this be privatized, let's get some independent think tanks that DO NOT have political or constituent agendas to address some of these issues based on the numbers... based on test studies and some reliable data...

I'm not holding my breath...
 

CrunkJuice

King of the Dirty South
Joined
Aug 26, 2008
Location
Dixieland Bayou
I chipped a tooth and ain't got no insurance, I just argued with my last insurance company for 8 months and it was about to go on my credit and to a colleciton agency bc of prexisting condition clauses. The gov is about to make prexisting illegal and hopefully about to give me free health care. I need it, so ya, I used to be a republican in college and I listened to all of the corporate spun propaganda against it, bc the insurance companies don't want this to happen. Only thing is I won't put a chip in me if that is the only way to get the free health care.
 

FrankieButNotEdgar

Well-Known Member
Site Donor
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
I pay for mine but my mother worked hard all her life and she doesn't have healthcare. She went to get a prescription today for Lunesta, some sinus medication and it was over 300 dollars. She told them to kiss her ass, she rejects that on principal.

I believe in working hard and being rewarded but there are times where things don't work out for everyone. My mother needs healthcare but working independent, she doesn't have it. And at over 200 bucks a month, is it worth paying for at times. I guess it's a double edged sword.
 

Gr8_White_Rabbit

GnP that Diverticulitis
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Location
Virginia
As it relates to America, I feel that universal healthcare is a good idea in theory. My primary concern is how will this program be funded? I do not want higher taxes just because someone can not afford insurance.
 
T

thebwit

Guest
Ok here's a stance from someone who actually knows a lot of about health care at the hospital. I am not going to divulge details of my personal life but I have a vested interest in this.

Nearly 8 years ago now Bush enacted what he called Health Care for everyone. He said if you don't have insurance, just go to an emergency room and they (the hospital) will cover it. No hospital is allowed to refuse service to you if they take even $1 in government funds. Yes there are private hospitals and if you come in with a true emergency, then they can't refuse you. But if you come in complaining of say pain in your big toe, they can.

Back on track. Before this was told to everyone, people as a general rule did the following: If they had a family practitioner that they went and saw on a regular basis if they had insurance. If not, they would go to an Urgent care clinic where the cost was kept down for minor things. They would only use the ER as a place to go for Emergencies.

Now that everyone found out that hospitals can't refuse people, everyone goes to the ER for everything. From the minor - ingrown toenail to the major - heart attack. This has caused a lot of emergency rooms nation wide to institute a fast track or urgent care of their own for the non emergencies. This is working out ok, but it isn't flawless as not every ER has this.

On top of this, people are now having to actually wait, which they complain about, to see a doctor. Which then leads to more lawsuits, which ties up more hospital funds, and you can see what is going on. The currently insured people have to pay more to cover the costs of the people who don't have insurance and just show up. How much more you ask? It starts at a min of about 6 times more - standard urgent care cost for going in with fever/headache is ~ $50. minimum for an ER visit is $300. You can do the math.

The other problem is that people don't know about getting prescription plans separate from health insurance. There are a lot of companies who are doing this and they cover a lot of drugs (not all), but then even some health insurance plans don't cover all drugs. Here's a tip - Walmart has a prescription plan.

So am I in favor of a universal health care plan? If it means that people will stop using the ER as an urgent care/Family Practitioner then yes, I am all for it. Anything to keep the costs down at a hospital benefits everyone.
 

Harlem Hustler

Dont argue, I'm always right!
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Location
Harlem NYC
As it relates to America, I feel that universal healthcare is a good idea in theory. My primary concern is how will this program be funded? I do not want higher taxes just because someone can not afford insurance.
Why not? What the fuck is wrong with some of you heartless fucking people sometimes? All you do is bitch and wine, "ahhh my taxes gonna go up." Get the fuck over it. There are more important things in this world than you complaining about paying a little higher tax for the quality of life for Americans.
 

vore9000

New Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Why not? What the fuck is wrong with some of you heartless fucking people sometimes? All you do is bitch and wine, "ahhh my taxes gonna go up." Get the fuck over it. There are more important things in this world than you complaining about paying a little higher tax for the quality of life for Americans.
I agree with this totally.

American culture is so fucking selfish sometimes it scares me.
 

Gr8_White_Rabbit

GnP that Diverticulitis
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Location
Virginia
Why not? What the fuck is wrong with some of you heartless fucking people sometimes? All you do is bitch and wine, "ahhh my taxes gonna go up." Get the fuck over it. There are more important things in this world than you complaining about paying a little higher tax for the quality of life for Americans.
This is America. You are supposed to work hard for the things in life you want/need. Get a fucking job and leave my hard earned money alone. This country is becoming an entitlement state and that is far from what it once was. Capitalism FTW!
 

Krazikarl

Cthulhu fhtagn
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Gr8_White_Rabbit said:
This is America. You are supposed to work hard for the things in life you want/need. Get a fucking job and leave my hard earned money alone. This country is becoming an entitlement state and that is far from what it once was. Capitalism FTW!
Well, you are right that this country did run on pretty much unfettered Capitalism.

And it was a disaster. There was essentially no middle class - there were the very rich, and the poor, who were generally uneducated and died young because they had to work early, hard, and didnt get little things like health care. Of course, they didnt get paid jack shit because in pure Capitalism, the workers arent going to get paid much.

Thankfully we have had some liberal reforms since the bad old days. We basically have a middle class and whatnot because we went away from pure Capitalism. Unless your parents were very wealthy, pretty much the entire reason you are doing OK in life is because these reforms gave you the opportunity to do so.

Universal health care is probably another reform that needs to happen someday. But, as people are pointing out, there are huge problems with implementation. So clearly ideas need to be worked out well there.

Note that since we already pay a lot of health care (private health care), its not like taxes would necessarily be raised that much. After all, health care providers make HUGE bucks, so that profit could cover the inevitable government inefficiencies that would come about. Then again, you could have a disasterous implementation, which would result in things getting very expensive. Thats why I'm not exactly for implementing this stuff too quickly since we need to ease into it.

Universal Health Care for children is a good start. You cant possible bitch about working hard, getting a job, and entitlement when it comes to 6 year olds. The system drops the ball on kids whose parents are the one who might have screwed up, and that needs fixing. Its one Obama idea that I like quite a bit.
 

Poindexter

Reputation: ∞
Staff member
Joined
Aug 26, 2008
Location
The Abyss
Ok here's a stance from someone who actually knows a lot of about health care at the hospital. I am not going to divulge details of my personal life but I have a vested interest in this.

Nearly 8 years ago now Bush enacted what he called Health Care for everyone. He said if you don't have insurance, just go to an emergency room and they (the hospital) will cover it. No hospital is allowed to refuse service to you if they take even $1 in government funds. Yes there are private hospitals and if you come in with a true emergency, then they can't refuse you. But if you come in complaining of say pain in your big toe, they can.

Back on track. Before this was told to everyone, people as a general rule did the following: If they had a family practitioner that they went and saw on a regular basis if they had insurance. If not, they would go to an Urgent care clinic where the cost was kept down for minor things. They would only use the ER as a place to go for Emergencies.

Now that everyone found out that hospitals can't refuse people, everyone goes to the ER for everything. From the minor - ingrown toenail to the major - heart attack. This has caused a lot of emergency rooms nation wide to institute a fast track or urgent care of their own for the non emergencies. This is working out ok, but it isn't flawless as not every ER has this.

On top of this, people are now having to actually wait, which they complain about, to see a doctor. Which then leads to more lawsuits, which ties up more hospital funds, and you can see what is going on. The currently insured people have to pay more to cover the costs of the people who don't have insurance and just show up. How much more you ask? It starts at a min of about 6 times more - standard urgent care cost for going in with fever/headache is ~ $50. minimum for an ER visit is $300. You can do the math.

The other problem is that people don't know about getting prescription plans separate from health insurance. There are a lot of companies who are doing this and they cover a lot of drugs (not all), but then even some health insurance plans don't cover all drugs. Here's a tip - Walmart has a prescription plan.

So am I in favor of a universal health care plan? If it means that people will stop using the ER as an urgent care/Family Practitioner then yes, I am all for it. Anything to keep the costs down at a hospital benefits everyone.
Great post - I appreciate the thought you put into it. It's pretty devastating to have people die that you know/love when they could have had better care if they could have afforded it.
 

Noob

www.myspace.com/mmaspot
Joined
Aug 23, 2008
My understanding of the US health care system is that it is one of the most bloated and inefficient systems of all time.

I would feel more optimistic about a plan for universal health care, or any health care system for that matter, if there were some effective improvements in spending habits.
 

TriangleSmoke

Motherfucker of the Century
Site Donor
Joined
Aug 26, 2008
Location
Where the pyramid meets the eye
my cousin married a French-Canadian woman and offered to move to Canada so she could stay close to her family, but she wanted to move to America because of the health care here. Seems pretty ironic to me. She said that free health care was nice until you look at the big picture i.e. getting cancer or a serious disease and being put on a wait list. She said that is way more common in Canada, but this was a few years ago and I've never heard any other Canadian say this.
 
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
my cousin married a French-Canadian woman and offered to move to Canada so she could stay close to her family, but she wanted to move to America because of the health care here. Seems pretty ironic to me. She said that free health care was nice until you look at the big picture i.e. getting cancer or a serious disease and being put on a wait list. She said that is way more common in Canada, but this was a few years ago and I've never heard any other Canadian say this.
Speaking as a Canadian, this is unfortunately what happens. Everything has a Pro and Con, while I dont need to pay to have stiches put in if I slice myself open, depending on how serious it is, I could be waiting a few hours to have it done.

Right now in NB theres a huge debate regarding or Health Ministers stance on partial privatization of healthcare. He doesnt want to entirely privatize it, but wants some privatization to help with wait times at the ER or Outpatients, and waiting lists for organ donations.

People are afraid that once this is implemented, the whole Healthcare sector will become privatized. Universal healthcare is something Canadians pride themselves in. Sure our taxes are at 14% right now, but if that means I can get away with keeping a little extra in pocket in the event something serious happens, I'll take a shot in the mouth.
 

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