The Rigged Election

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Georgia election official shoots down Trump's election conspiracy theories
(CNN) — A top Georgia election official said Monday that "everybody's vote did count" in the state's November elections as he shot down a list of voter fraud conspiracy theories President Donald Trump aired in a call with Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger this weekend.

"The reason I'm having to stand here today is because there are people in positions of authority and respect who have said their votes didn't count, and it's not true," said Gabriel Sterling, the voting systems implementation manager for the Georgia Secretary of State's office, during a news conference.

In audio first reported by The Washington Post and obtained by CNN, Trump is heard pressuring Raffensperger, who is also a Republican, to "find" votes to overturn the election in Georgia, which he lost to President-elect Joe Biden. Raffensperger rebuffed Trump's demand.

In excerpts of the stunning one-hour phone call Saturday, Trump lambasted his fellow Republican for refusing to falsely say that he won the election in Georgia and repeatedly touted baseless claims of election fraud.

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"The people of Georgia are angry, the people of the country are angry. And there's nothing wrong with saying that, you know, um, that you've recalculated," Trump said in one part of the call. Raffensperger responded, "Well, Mr. President, the challenge that you have is, the data you have is wrong."

In another part, Trump said: "So look, all I want to do is this, I just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have. Because we won the state."

Sterling said Monday that the President's voter fraud claims are "all easily, provably false" as he ran through some of the conspiracy theories that Trump floated on his call with Raffensperger.

Addressing Trump's claim that ballots had been shredded, Sterling said flatly: "There is no shredding of ballots going on. That's not real. It's not happening."

Turning to Trump's questions out Dominion voting machines being nefariously removed, Sterling asserted: "No one is changing parts or pieces out of Dominion voting machines. I don't even know what that means."
"It's not a real thing. That's not happening," he said.

As he sought to emphasize the unfounded nature of Trump's claims, Sterling lamented the way the President's message could still undermine Georgia residents' faith in the state's election system ahead of Tuesday's critical US Senate runoffs.

If either of the incumbent Republicans -- Sens. Kelly Loeffler and David Perdue -- holds on to their seat, the party will maintain its majority control in the chamber.

If Democratic challengers Jon Ossoff and the Rev. Raphael Warnock both prevail, however, Democrats would gain control of the Senate thanks to Vice President-elect Kamala Harris' tie-breaking vote.

"If you're a Georgia voter, if you want your values reflected by your election officials, I strongly beg and encourage you, go vote tomorrow. Do not let anybody discourage you. Do not self-suppress your own vote. Do not make a self-fulfilling prophecy out of doing this. Don't let anybody steal your vote that way," Sterling said.

"And that's what's happening. If you self-suppress, you are taking away your important voice from this election."

Georgia recertified its presidential election results in December following three counts of ballots that yielded no evidence of the widespread voter fraud Trump and his allies have claimed.

Despite this, the President has launched an extraordinary effort to change the results of the race in Georgia and other key battleground states that Biden won. The futile bid has garnered support from a number of congressional Republicans, who plan to challenge electoral votes when Congress is expected to certify Biden's victory on Wednesday.

None of the challenges, though, will change the fact that Biden will be the next president of the United States, and multiple courts have thrown out challenges to the election.

"At the end of the day, we want to make sure people understand their votes count," Sterling said Monday. "Every person, every voice matters."

This story has been updated with more from the news conference.
 

Anchorpunch

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Georgia election official shoots down Trump's election conspiracy theories
I wish people like them got more of a voice. If this is the same person I heard on the original clip, I hate that they didn't have the evidence to shut Trump up on hand (but completely understand why).
 

Ninjastix

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I mean, what evidence do you think is going to shut up Trump? Trump isn't delusional. He's not unaware he lost, he knows he lost. He's looking to circumvent the loss and the strategy from the inner circles is also not stupid, it's not crazy, it's not nonsensical. The approach, since his inauguration, is to seize on populist sentiment and undermine institutions of trust like public service, like the military, like journalism. This is an extension of the administration's war on Facts.

They're actively undermining institutions the same way Trump undermines legality while operating his businesses. He's enabled because of a political maneuvering. This the group that took a sharpie to a weather map to "show" the nation that a hurricane not forecast to hit Alabama was forecast to hit Alabama.

There's no objective truth or rational argument that will dissuade Trump and his allies. Not because they're stupid. Not because they're insane. But because this is their strategy.
 

Anchorpunch

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I mean, what evidence do you think is going to shut up Trump? Trump isn't delusional. He's not unaware he lost, he knows he lost. He's looking to circumvent the loss and the strategy from the inner circles is also not stupid, it's not crazy, it's not nonsensical. The approach, since his inauguration, is to seize on populist sentiment and undermine institutions of trust like public service, like the military, like journalism. This is an extension of the administration's war on Facts.

They're actively undermining institutions the same way Trump undermines legality while operating his businesses. He's enabled because of a political maneuvering. This the group that took a sharpie to a weather map to "show" the nation that a hurricane not forecast to hit Alabama was forecast to hit Alabama.

There's no objective truth or rational argument that will dissuade Trump and his allies. Not because they're stupid. Not because they're insane. But because this is their strategy.
Trump's not the issue. One man shouting crazy only goes so far. But add in the appearance of credible claims on the election that more politicians can hold on to, and you're fucked.
 

Ninjastix

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No, that is the issue. Because one man screaming is affecting what is being considered "credible".
 

Anchorpunch

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No, that is the issue. Because one man screaming is affecting what is being considered "credible".
If our system is so weak that it can't withstand the claims of one man in isolation, the problem is the system. What we have is a mix of that and a real problem with broad misinformation coming into congress. I've been following the claims and, some of them, if you don't really dig into them, look credible. That's keeping the ship afloat.
 

Nebraska

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This whole thread boils down to fundraising. Nothing more. It is no different than the way Republicans got rich off of patriotic sentiment in the wake of 9/11.
 

Anchorpunch

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I heard a guy bragging the other day about how he donated over 1k to the fund. I said that's awful nice of you to help pay down his tax debt, cuz that's all you're doing.
He's also funding the end of democracy, so really it's a bargain.
 

Ninjastix

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This whole thread boils down to fundraising. Nothing more. It is no different than the way Republicans got rich off of patriotic sentiment in the wake of 9/11.
Or how gun makers profit from mass shootings. But I don't think it's just fund raising so much as.. this is the Trump strategy. Listen to Cruz's first sentence here speaking on Fox:


Legitimacy is reduced to common suspicion ignoring the obvious bias and benefit. Pandora's box has been opened and they've shifted normal. We now enter into the unknown with the rise of social media and disinformation consumption.

Good luck.
 

Anchorpunch

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Attention from who?
For one, the Georgia state congress who helped with FOI requests. And now more conservative speakers. I wouldn't laugh it off. End of the day: There is now documentation of vote switching that isn't well auditable and is being claimed as fraud while silence sits on the other side. This isn't going away.
 

Nebraska

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For one, the Georgia state congress who helped with FOI requests. And now more conservative speakers. I wouldn't laugh it off. End of the day: There is now documentation of vote switching that isn't well auditable and is being claimed as fraud while silence sits on the other side. This isn't going away.
Bro, get out of the rabbit hole. That bitch is a producer for Hannity’s radio show.
 

Anchorpunch

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Weird that paper ballots switched too and that multiple recounts didn't catch it.
No. The switches reported were due to adjudication so they include paper ballots. Their point, as discussed by @Goremire as well, is that a) those occurred at weirdly high rates, b) the original is not kept in the event of the adjudication (at least claimed to be so in Georgia).
 

Goremire

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No. The switches reported were due to adjudication so they include paper ballots. Their point, as discussed by @Goremire as well, is that a) those occurred at weirdly high rates, b) the original is not kept in the event of the adjudication (at least claimed to be so in Georgia).
Yeah this is the critical point - this Data Integrity Group can allege fraud for the vote switches and there's no way to prove them wrong. Now, there's no way for them to prove fraud actually happened either - but that's not their goal. Their goal is to cast doubt in a way that looks scientifically robust. They also have the initiative here - they're getting their version of what the data says out there and starting to build momentum and nobody is saying that they're wrong.
 

Poindexter

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Yeah this is the critical point - this Data Integrity Group can allege fraud for the vote switches and there's no way to prove them wrong. Now, there's no way for them to prove fraud actually happened either - but that's not their goal. Their goal is to cast doubt in a way that looks scientifically robust. They also have the initiative here - they're getting their version of what the data says out there and starting to build momentum and nobody is saying that they're wrong.
I’m guessing the same thing must have happened in the run-offs?
 

Goremire

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I’m guessing the same thing must have happened in the run-offs?
Oh, totally. Must have been the same four observers (two Dem and two presumably turncoat Republican) switching all the runoff votes too.

On the Fox Business piece they claimed that over 100,000 votes had been adjudicated in about 24 hours, and that as each adjudication takes approximately 30-60 seconds this is impossible given there were only 4 people doing it (two Dems, two Reps) . Of course, their own case is that this is how the 'fraud' was perpetuated. So once you look closer it starts to fall apart.

Again, it's a bunch of bullshit but the change in tack is concerning. It's like you're 3 rounds into a fight against a dumb, predictable opponent who just plods forwards throwing the same 1-2 combo, over and over. But then he comes out in the 4th and feints the jab, then cuts an angle into a body kick before circling out of range. It misses, but all of a sudden the fight has changed.

It looks to me like an attempt to sway the non rabid MAGA slice of the Republican base. Showing that Trump was right about the election being stolen, but not for the reasons the frothing true believers have been ranting about.

I had a look at the AMA and the guy doing it was shooting down other MAGA conspiracy theories when they were brought up. Like the really bananas ones. Kept talking about how they were focused on the data, and only what they could "prove". That's a level of sophistication we haven't seen up til now.

If you watch the video you'll see they don't come across like kooks. Which makes them more dangerous than a thousand gibbering maniacs on Twitter.
 

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Theoretically, what happens if we rid politics of those that serve anything but the people, how long before the next Reagan-to-Trump slide of flipflopping, pandering, lying, greedy, politicians. What's funny too, having known someone who is a lawyer for DoJ, everyone knew about Trump and co, knew of his treason, but it's allowed to happen because there's nothing you can do, the party allows it because it's for the party, the oiled machine of the party. For years these people have been trying to rig the system by feeding on literal idiots, and this Biden presidency is barely a drop in a bucket for what needs to be done, remind everyone he voted for the war in iraq, but I'm sure the people who passionately follow politics on this forum know that. He's just like other corporate democrats, they are the former republicans. Maybe a different thread, I'm just trying to currently wrap my head around the possibility of rebuilding who leads, if that's even possible, it doesn't feel so, as it is now there's always going to be rigged Kentucky among others, which is also one of the main purposes of this movement to disband the electoral college.
 

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