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The depth of the Russian doping program - Watch Icarus

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by thumper, Aug 6, 2017.

  1. thumper

    thumper all around great guy Staff Member

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    Holy shit. I had no idea. I'm probably really late to see any of this. but i never knew it was this serious, and how they infiltrated the a/b samples is unreal

    This whole thing started out with a guy poking around the doping in cycling story and he literally uncovered and documented the whole scandal.

    His words

    "I was making a film about doping in cycling – then I uncovered the Russian scandal"

    What's mind blowing is all this is caught from the inside, and from a man very close to the top.

    if you really want to know about the effectiveness of WADA (essentially non-existant). you should watch this.

    What's amazing is, this isn't a documentary, it's more of a play by play. It's hard to explain.

    If you have Netflix, go watch Icarus, it will likely shock you.

    https://www.netflix.com/title/80168079
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2017
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  2. jesusatemyhotdog

    jesusatemyhotdog Welcome to the machine.

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    Yeah. The Russians are good at mass conspiracies.
     
  3. slikguy

    slikguy Damn!

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    Great doco. Thanks
     
  4. Noise

    Noise Ruido

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    Very good doc, watched it last night.
     
  5. thumper

    thumper all around great guy Staff Member

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    Sure thing. Was surprised. I didn't pay much attention to the description, found it posted in a comment somewhere else. I like documentaries so i bookmarked it and started watching today.

    it's long, but it blows my mind how it started vs what it turned into

    and somehow I find myself feeling bad for the guy. Not sure why, but i do. not like he was a good guy
    yup. Man Netflix really does have some good original programming.
     
  6. Spoon

    Spoon There is no Spoon

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    I've only watched half of it so far, but it's crazy. I remember when the whole scandal was reported on. Stuff about holes in walls where they'd drop samples down shoots to another floor. But murders, FBI getting involved... these producers really go into this situation at the exact right time for this to explode. Hopefully I'll finish it tomorrow.
     
  7. thumper

    thumper all around great guy Staff Member

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    I don't know if you've gotten past his initial reason for the documentary and what his goal was so I don't want to ruin it if you haven't gotten there. but let me know if you're past the point where he's done with his cycle and does the Haute Route again. I wont spoil it till then

    Pretty sure you're past that if you're 1/2 way through. the damned thing is 2 hours long.
     
  8. kanobro

    kanobro My New Challenge Site Donor

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    Two things:

    WOW, GREAT DOCUMENTARY.

    Belichick almost had me fooled with that Russian accent and moustache.
     
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  9. Spoon

    Spoon There is no Spoon

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    Yup, I was about an hour in when it took an entirely different turn. Just finished watching the last half. Shit is crazy.
    Show Spoiler
    At first I thought he might actually be nuts and making it all up, but damn, it was all legit. And it all ended up being for nothing.
     
  10. thumper

    thumper all around great guy Staff Member

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    I edited your post, just to add a spoiler tag in case others are interested but haven't seen it yet.

    Show Spoiler

    yeah the part that really bugged me, even though i knew it was coming, was that they had them dead to rights (Russia) and they had already laid the smack down destroying the Russian program. Only to find out miraculously everything is reversed just before the games start.

    I mean seriously, that was fucked up.

    I remember all that shit happening but seeing the context it all happened in sure paints a different story.

    I was like you. At first I thought he was bullshit, till I started learning more about who he is. but by the end there's no doubt it's completely legit. Well, i'll admit, soon as it got serious I googled him to see if he was dead yet. it's only a matter of time

    Also, i did feel bad for the guy at the end. you realize when you go into witness protection that means he can't visit, talk to or even write letters to his family again. pretty much forever. Because if he does you know damned well the KGB is monitoring it. and honestly I think they're in grave danger anyway.

    Just the way everyone found him was mind blowing

    But the whole story changes my mind on USADA, WADA and doping athletes I'll tell you that for sure.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2017
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  11. slikguy

    slikguy Damn!

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    Everyone is cheating. Testing is a waste of time
     
  12. thumper

    thumper all around great guy Staff Member

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    Wow it's really cool to listen to the guy that made the documentary (Bryan Fogel) talk about it on JRE

    Worth the watch!

     
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  13. thumper

    thumper all around great guy Staff Member

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    I'd like to add something here. there's a slight... well actually, enormous facade in his statements and he's pretty manipulative too.

    But wasn't this 'loving' 'kind' person the guy that was excited to help him juice and cheat his way to win a race in the beginning?

    Also, he said 'Athletes around the world are getting their medals stolen!'. Nice drama, but before he got into the story he said (and said Gregory told him) that no athletes can medal in the Olympics without juicing.

    Nobody 'stole' anything. if anything I'm guessing the Russian athletes weren't doing it because they wanted to, they were told to. Everyone else in non-communist countries did them voluntarily

    I liked Gregory but let's not pretend he's so innocent. he was all too happy to help him cheat in the beginning without knowing what he was doing.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2017
  14. Spoon

    Spoon There is no Spoon

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    Russia banned from the 2018 Winter Olympics in PyeongChang





    Here's the IOC's full report:
     
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  15. thumper

    thumper all around great guy Staff Member

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    yerah i saw that. fucking AWESOME to see something good come from it all
    --- Post Added -- Dec 5, 2017, ---
    and the reality is, after Icarus came out, the IOC had little choice after this last deal but to wield a heavy hammer, or become irrelevant.
     
  16. Qball1974

    Qball1974 Tower of Song Site Donor

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    Never enjoyed the Olympics,

    So I'm missing nothing.

    Well I watched hockey long time ago,

    Burn me.
     
  17. Poindexter

    Poindexter Reputation: ∞ Staff Member

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    The Olympics are great. It's not packaged like a commodity—because of which many can't digest the experience. It takes thoughtfulness to appreciate. That, in this day and age, is not a developed virtue for the most part.
     
  18. Qball1974

    Qball1974 Tower of Song Site Donor

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    Pissed me off as a kid when 6 of my 8 T.V channels was filled with this shit for 2 weeks.
     
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  19. kanobro

    kanobro My New Challenge Site Donor

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    Missy Franklin won Olympic gold then came back to USA and finish her high school swimming career.

    Can you imagine the kids, yes kids, on the other high school team swimming against an Olympic gold medalist.
     
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